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Original 95th Buttons - status
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Tobias
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Joined: 27 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 4:50 pm    Post subject: Original 95th Buttons - status  Reply with quote

Hello Forum!

New member and my first post.

I wonder if anyone here has information regarding the number of known authentic 95th buttons. I read the piece on the website, and it seems the first two known examples were identified in 2003. Has there been any development?

Many thanks in advance

Tobias
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Paul Durrant
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Tobias,

As far as I'm aware, there is no tally of original buttons found. The story of how we came to find one and copy is on our website:
http://95th-rifles.co.uk/equipment/regimental-button/

I believe we donated the one we had to a museum - who can no longer find it!

I think one of our members has one - also a battlefield find.

Watch ebay!
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Ben Townsend
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adrian Roads of the Australian 2/95th I believe has compiled a list of up to 13 known buttons. One of these was donated to the RGJ museum Winchester by Blakey. One of the others is in my possession, along with another dug in Urrugne, that is not on Adrian's list afaik. I know of another partial button dug in Kent and am sure there are many more in private collections.
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Tobias
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul Durrant wrote:
Hi Tobias,

As far as I'm aware, there is no tally of original buttons found. The story of how we came to find one and copy is on our website:
http://95th-rifles.co.uk/equipment/regimental-button/

I believe we donated the one we had to a museum - who can no longer find it!

I think one of our members has one - also a battlefield find.

Watch ebay!


Many thanks for the reply, Paul! I have read the article with interest.

How sad that the one you donated has disappeared!

The primary reason I wanted to check the status was that I was lucky enough to find one in a field in Denmark the other weekend. It is very close to Blaesenborg Kro, southwest of Roskilde, where Wellesley had his HQ for a short period while clearing countryside resistance.

Other finds from the general area related to the events of 1808 include one partial emblem from a chakot of the 95th and two buttons from the Royal Horse Artillery.

I have attached a picture for your reference (unfortunately, the backmark is covered by a thin layer of corrosion, and the shank is missing).

If anyone knows of other 95th buttons it would be really interesting to find out.

Regards

Tobias
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Tobias
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 5:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ben wrote:
Adrian Roads of the Australian 2/95th I believe has compiled a list of up to 13 known buttons. One of these was donated to the RGJ museum Winchester by Blakey. One of the others is in my possession, along with another dug in Urrugne, that is not on Adrian's list afaik. I know of another partial button dug in Kent and am sure there are many more in private collections.


Many thanks for the information, Ben!

If it would be possible for you to share this list, I would be much obliged.

Regards

Tobias
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Ben Townsend
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tobias, thank you for showing us your beautiful find. Can you also post the partial element of the buglehorn badge for the regimental cap (shako). These are also of great interest.

In addition, if you can provide measurements of the button in mm, that will help with comparisons.

I will contact Adrian Roads to get his list of the existing buttons and post here. Bear with me, its a while since I have focused on this.

The latest from the museum is that the button donated is still with them. Certainly they have photographed it.
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Tobias
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks!

I will post the additional information and a picture of the bugle as soon as I get back home (am travelling at the moment). I will admit that I am not 100% sure regarding the use of the bugle, since it is in copper alloy (it seems the chako badges were usually made of tin/pewter). Hopefully the community will be able to settle it for me.

Regards

Tobias
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Ben Townsend
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In fact the only Georgian other ranks badges for light infantry/rifle corps known of are in a yellow metal. These have been dug at sites in Spain, North America, England and France.

The idea that they were white metal has been entirely superceded for some years.

When you post the pics we can see whether they corroborate the other dug badges. In the meantime, here is an image of the Urrugne button.



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Tobias
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ben wrote:
In fact the only Georgian other ranks badges for light infantry/rifle corps known of are in a yellow metal. These have been dug at sites in Spain, North America, England and France.

The idea that they were white metal has been entirely superceded for some years.

When you post the pics we can see whether they corroborate the other dug badges. In the meantime, here is an image of the Urrugne button.


Thanks for the image, Ben!

The button is 15 mm in diameter. I'll try to take some better shots during the weekend.

Attached is also the partial bugle found in the same general area.

Thanks for all your assistance!

Regards

Tobias

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Paul Durrant
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh sweeet!
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Tobias
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul Durrant wrote:
Oh sweeet!


Thanks, Paul!

If you are referring to the bugle, I take it you consider it to be from the 95th as well. Are there any specific parallels you have in mind?

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Tobias
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Ben Townsend
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tobias,

Here are some images of a few of the corroborating finds of Georgian LI cap badges. These include, in order, examples found in The Peninsula, in France, in North America and in England, at sites known to be associated with British army activity.

First two images courtesy of and from collection of Thomas Nielson, second belongs to James Kochan, and the last is my own Fragment from Kent, compared to one recreated from the Kochan horn.


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Ben Townsend
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

regarding Tobias' original question as to number of buttons, Adrian Roads has informed me that he and Dave G came up with 14 buttons. There was the first one that was shown to the 2/95th UK in about 2005 which was soon followed by another bought by Blakey and subsequently donated, Dave said there were also 9 in a museum in Salamanca, another had surfaced I forget where, plus the two Adrian obtained, one of which went from Dave G to Ben T.

I have called Dave G to get some clarity on this list. I have personally never seen those in Salamanca and presume they are in a private museum.
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Tobias
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ben wrote:
Tobias,

Here are some images of a few of the corroborating finds of Georgian LI cap badges. These include, in order, examples found in The Peninsula, in France, in North America and in England, at sites known to be associated with British army activity.

First two images courtesy of and from collection of Thomas Nielson, second belongs to James Kochan, and the last is my own Fragment from Kent, compared to one recreated from the Kochan horn.


Wow, that's great! It certainly looks the part, and the size seems to fit as well.

Regards

Tobias
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Tobias
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ben wrote:
regarding Tobias' original question as to number of buttons, Adrian Roads has informed me that he and Dave G came up with 14 buttons. There was the first one that was shown to the 2/95th UK in about 2005 which was soon followed by another bought by Blakey and subsequently donated, Dave said there were also 9 in a museum in Salamanca, another had surfaced I forget where, plus the two Adrian obtained, one of which went from Dave G to Ben T.

I have called Dave G to get some clarity on this list. I have personally never seen those in Salamanca and presume they are in a private museum.


I really appreciate the update and all your help!

Regards

Tobias

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