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myrmiddon

Seafield Collection Pouches

Hi All,

Was curious if anyone here has had a chance to view/examine the pouches in the Seafield Collection at Fort George? Was looking at the stack of pouches in online imagery and would like to know more. If I'm seeing right, one of the pouches in the image below, case in front of the left soldier, has a brass badge on it, and seems to be without a block. I'm surprised there's not more info on these items available. Anyone able to comment in depth?

http://tinyurl.com/d3pqddk

Sincerely,

Alex Good
Ben Townsend

Hi Alex,
Paul Durrant will have some comments to make on this. He is presently on holiday and expected to retutn in a week or two, the colour of old mahogany, and sporting flipflops inappropriate for a man of his age and disticntion. You may well get some useful insight at that point.
myrmiddon

Thanks  Ben. Will be nice to hear from him on this.

Alex
Ben Townsend

I'm expecting the pouches to be the 36 round with invertable wooden block, they would have the tim 24rd magazine to complement them, but best wait for Paul to comment.
myrmiddon

Hi Ben,

You'd think, eh? Though I tend to wonder if any of those items
were purchased/inherited from AWI-era fencible regiments and
put to reuse? Most Highland regiments seem to have already gone
to white belts and straps by 1793/4, while these ones are black.

Alex
Paul Durrant

Alex,
I'm afraid I still haven't managed to get up the Far North to see these items up close. One of our guys, Iain, went up last year for a visit and took piccies of the display but that is about as close as we got.

As you also point out, info seems a little sketchy...

We've posted two sets of pix in the thread 'Cartridge pouches - Locations' http://2nd95thrifles.myfastforum.org/about981.html

The first are a set from the Seafield collection. These are certainly the 32 round (18 holed, double ended, blocks) on display. You can see the leather 'pull' extending from behind the block that would allow the soldier to pull the block out. Iain notes these as possibly belonging to the Strathspey Fencibles and consequently would be in black leather cross straps. However the mannequin in the background of your link, http://tinyurl.com/d3pqddk may well have the pattern that is attributed the 97th which we have featured further down the page. This is in the NAM and is attributed to the 97th and has a white buff strap.

I think the NAM also have one of the Seafield's double-ended block type. Unfortunately the NAM overhaul means we can't access their collection until Autumn (if we're lucky!).
myrmiddon

Hi Guys,

Managed to get some images of pouches in the Seafield Collection.

Is it me, or do these badged pouches look like they're repurposed
from the AWI era?

Alex

















myrmiddon

Second style pouch in the collection. This one is definitely 1790s. There's a third that I'm working to get images of.

Alex














Paul Durrant

Well done Alex! (Editing this since posting)

Very interesting - and in some ways, quite bizarre!

Did you manage to get the reversible block one?

But what to say? I don't really know enough about the post AWI pouches. On service (certainly at the turn of the 1800s) they were being issued with 60rnds - 36 in a pouch and the balance of 24 in a leather covered tin magazine carried on the bayonet cross belt. This tin magazine was first issued in 1784. See 2/3rds down page on this thread;

http://2nd95thrifles.myfastforum.org/ftopic981-0-asc-15.php

That magazine was in service until 1808. Not sure when they dispensed with a a tin upper and replaced with a drilled block (the Rifles pouch of 1800 was described as a wooden drilled block with tin below).

The wood and the tin in that first pouch looks like it was made yesterday! The cross-strap retainer on the back looks horrendous (and thin). Unless they all have metal buttons, I would have said that's probably a replacement for a leather one.

The second looks like it's starting to lean towards our period. I take it they have tins inside also? Any pix of the inside?

Here is one from the NAM that is supposed to be from the collection:
Ammunition pouch, 97th Regiment of Foot, 1794-1796©National Army Museum;
myrmiddon

Hi Paul,

I'm working to get more snaps... My understanding from others
that have viewed the collection is that the pouch with white straps that
I posted has the usual 36 round, two tin set up inside, and was, as you said, widely used post-1784. The one with the oval brass badge however looks like a throw-back towards 18 round woodblock over tin/no tin pouches used by the Light Infantry during the AWI, and leaves me suspicious that it as a hand-me-down from one of the fencible regiments in Scotland circa 1778-83. Wish I could prove that.

Thanks for the follow-on photos. Working to get images of that pattern
too. The more I look at the photos you posted the more I think there might be MORE than three patterns. Oy... Wish these items were a little
more provenenced.

Alex

Paul Durrant wrote:
Well done Alex! (Editing this since posting)

Very interesting - and in some ways, quite bizarre!

Did you manage to get the reversible block one?

But what to say? I don't really know enough about the post AWI pouches. On service (certainly at the turn of the 1800s) they were being issued with 60rnds - 36 in a pouch and the balance of 24 in a leather covered tin magazine carried on the bayonet cross belt. This tin magazine was first issued in 1784. See 2/3rds down page on this thread;

http://2nd95thrifles.myfastforum.org/ftopic981-0-asc-15.php

That magazine was in service until 1808. Not sure when they dispensed with a a tin upper and replaced with a drilled block (the Rifles pouch of 1800 was described as a wooden drilled block with tin below).

The wood and the tin in that first pouch looks like it was made yesterday! The cross-strap retainer on the back looks horrendous (and thin). Unless they all have metal buttons, I would have said that's probably a replacement for a leather one.

The second looks like it's starting to lean towards our period. I take it they have tins inside also? Any pix of the inside?

Here is one from the NAM that is supposed to be from the collection:
Ammunition pouch, 97th Regiment of Foot, 1794-1796©National Army Museum;

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